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	<title>Comments for Made by Many</title>
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	<link>http://madebymany.co.uk</link>
	<description>Made by Many creates very social digital stuff.</description>
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		<title>Comment on Can there ever be an online masterpiece? by Mark Bernstein</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-there-ever-be-an-online-masterpiece-003328#comment-16338</link>
		<dc:creator>Mark Bernstein</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Mar 2010 16:52:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3328#comment-16338</guid>
		<description>Your MBM colleague Elin Sjursen tweeted this url to me over the weekend, but I&#039;ve been onstage nonstop and so join the conversation a little late.

On the one hand, your criteria for &quot;masterpiece&quot; might be a little bit too stringent for the time.  You could argue, for example, that no visual artist since Picasso has created a masterpiece; Pollock&#039;s important -- so is Cindy Sherman -- but we can surely imagine the late 20th century without them.  Is there a novelist since Hemingway who is, in this sense, indispensable?  A classical composer since Shostakovich?  One shouldn&#039;t ask online art to do what no one can achieve.

Conversely, I think it&#039;s now safe to say that we have several hypertext fictions that essentially meet your standard.  Michael Joyce&#039;s _afternoon, a story_ and Shelley Jackson&#039;s _Patchwork Girl_ are obvious candidates here.  They&#039;ve been the subject of many, many books and even more scholarship. They&#039;re studied in colleges and universities throughout the world.  If you were a candidate for a PhD in, say, new media, and it came out in your orals that you didn&#039;t know _afternoon_ and its criticism, your committee might well send you back for more seasoning before granting your degree.  And I don&#039;t think you can really imagine a history of art in the late 20th century without the battle between late modernism and postmodernism, and no account of that conflict could properly omit literary hypertext, its champions and detractors.

I&#039;d also single out for consideration an unusual candidate: George P. Landow&#039;s _Context 32_, now know as The Victorian Web. http://victorianWeb.org/  Looking at it right now, one sees a very large and important scholarly compendium of what seems a familiar type; what one forgets is that this was originally done in *1986* and that it&#039;s migrated through generations of hypertext systems from Intermedia to Storyspace to various Web formalism.  This migration is also the answer to the apparent fragility of digital work: digital literature is easy to preserve, provided that people remain interested in reading it.  In today&#039;s world, that&#039;s all we can say for print.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your MBM colleague Elin Sjursen tweeted this url to me over the weekend, but I&#8217;ve been onstage nonstop and so join the conversation a little late.</p>
<p>On the one hand, your criteria for &#8220;masterpiece&#8221; might be a little bit too stringent for the time.  You could argue, for example, that no visual artist since Picasso has created a masterpiece; Pollock&#8217;s important &#8212; so is Cindy Sherman &#8212; but we can surely imagine the late 20th century without them.  Is there a novelist since Hemingway who is, in this sense, indispensable?  A classical composer since Shostakovich?  One shouldn&#8217;t ask online art to do what no one can achieve.</p>
<p>Conversely, I think it&#8217;s now safe to say that we have several hypertext fictions that essentially meet your standard.  Michael Joyce&#8217;s _afternoon, a story_ and Shelley Jackson&#8217;s _Patchwork Girl_ are obvious candidates here.  They&#8217;ve been the subject of many, many books and even more scholarship. They&#8217;re studied in colleges and universities throughout the world.  If you were a candidate for a PhD in, say, new media, and it came out in your orals that you didn&#8217;t know _afternoon_ and its criticism, your committee might well send you back for more seasoning before granting your degree.  And I don&#8217;t think you can really imagine a history of art in the late 20th century without the battle between late modernism and postmodernism, and no account of that conflict could properly omit literary hypertext, its champions and detractors.</p>
<p>I&#8217;d also single out for consideration an unusual candidate: George P. Landow&#8217;s _Context 32_, now know as The Victorian Web. <a href="http://victorianWeb.org/" rel="nofollow">http://victorianWeb.org/</a>  Looking at it right now, one sees a very large and important scholarly compendium of what seems a familiar type; what one forgets is that this was originally done in *1986* and that it&#8217;s migrated through generations of hypertext systems from Intermedia to Storyspace to various Web formalism.  This migration is also the answer to the apparent fragility of digital work: digital literature is easy to preserve, provided that people remain interested in reading it.  In today&#8217;s world, that&#8217;s all we can say for print.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Blog by Monday Marvels: SXSW &#124; Most Inspired: Design Inspiration Blog</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/blog#comment-16238</link>
		<dc:creator>Monday Marvels: SXSW &#124; Most Inspired: Design Inspiration Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Mar 2010 04:59:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany/?page_id=753#comment-16238</guid>
		<description>[...] awesome twitter mashup from the people at Made By Many, a design agency from London, [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] awesome twitter mashup from the people at Made By Many, a design agency from London, [...]</p>
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		<title>Comment on Can I Have My Opinion Back, Please? by John</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-i-have-my-opinion-back-please-003099#comment-16174</link>
		<dc:creator>John</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Mar 2010 00:17:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3099#comment-16174</guid>
		<description>Unfortunately, in-law (certainly so in Great Britain) many opinions are out-lawed....the home of &#039;Free Speech&#039; is gagged on a great many subjects.  God forbid I should ever venture such an opinion as : &#039;&#039; allowing over two million muslims into Britain was probably a bad idea!&#039;&#039;</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Unfortunately, in-law (certainly so in Great Britain) many opinions are out-lawed&#8230;.the home of &#8216;Free Speech&#8217; is gagged on a great many subjects.  God forbid I should ever venture such an opinion as : &#8221; allowing over two million muslims into Britain was probably a bad idea!&#8221;</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Kingdom of Awesome by uberVU - social comments</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/the-kingdom-of-awesome-003335#comment-16128</link>
		<dc:creator>uberVU - social comments</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 21:15:53 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3335#comment-16128</guid>
		<description>&lt;strong&gt;Social comments and analytics for this post...&lt;/strong&gt;

This post was mentioned on Twitter by malbonster: Just blogged about agencies, sharing, Shirky &amp; disruption &gt;&gt; &quot;The Kingdom of Awesome&quot; http://bit.ly/c7eqlP...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><strong>Social comments and analytics for this post&#8230;</strong></p>
<p>This post was mentioned on Twitter by malbonster: Just blogged about agencies, sharing, Shirky &amp; disruption &gt;&gt; &#8220;The Kingdom of Awesome&#8221; <a href="http://bit.ly/c7eqlP..." rel="nofollow">http://bit.ly/c7eqlP&#8230;</a></p>
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		<title>Comment on The Kingdom of Awesome by Stefan Erschwendner</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/the-kingdom-of-awesome-003335#comment-16117</link>
		<dc:creator>Stefan Erschwendner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 20:49:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3335#comment-16117</guid>
		<description>Hi Tim,

great blog post and totally to the point. 

I like to compare advertising agencies with the principal/agent theory. In the past you needed structures and teams to fully leverage your potential as a geek but nowadays thanks to sharing, openness and networks big agencies are just slow, expensive &amp; inflexible. 

It&#039;s time for a revolution and the whole executive board of the networks has no clue that they are today not just competing with other networks but also with small start ups and groups of individuals that for project teams.

As also Jeff Jarvis mentions in his book, there was never a more interesting time to be in advertising then now, because it won&#039;t be the same anymore and you can be part of the change.

Keep on doing awesomeness

Steff</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Tim,</p>
<p>great blog post and totally to the point. </p>
<p>I like to compare advertising agencies with the principal/agent theory. In the past you needed structures and teams to fully leverage your potential as a geek but nowadays thanks to sharing, openness and networks big agencies are just slow, expensive &amp; inflexible. </p>
<p>It&#8217;s time for a revolution and the whole executive board of the networks has no clue that they are today not just competing with other networks but also with small start ups and groups of individuals that for project teams.</p>
<p>As also Jeff Jarvis mentions in his book, there was never a more interesting time to be in advertising then now, because it won&#8217;t be the same anymore and you can be part of the change.</p>
<p>Keep on doing awesomeness</p>
<p>Steff</p>
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		<title>Comment on Can there ever be an online masterpiece? by Peter</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-there-ever-be-an-online-masterpiece-003328#comment-16116</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 20:45:16 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3328#comment-16116</guid>
		<description>agreement apart, I feel my argument meets the three identifiers you suggest. It is still only an infant. It&#039;s best work is still to come.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>agreement apart, I feel my argument meets the three identifiers you suggest. It is still only an infant. It&#8217;s best work is still to come.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Can there ever be an online masterpiece? by James Higgs</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-there-ever-be-an-online-masterpiece-003328#comment-16112</link>
		<dc:creator>James Higgs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 20:28:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3328#comment-16112</guid>
		<description>The internet more beguiling than &lt;em&gt;Tristan&lt;/em&gt; or &lt;em&gt;Ulysses&lt;/em&gt;? There&#039;s no way for us to agree on anything if our views are that far apart.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The internet more beguiling than <em>Tristan</em> or <em>Ulysses</em>? There&#8217;s no way for us to agree on anything if our views are that far apart.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Can there ever be an online masterpiece? by Peter</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-there-ever-be-an-online-masterpiece-003328#comment-16109</link>
		<dc:creator>Peter</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 20:21:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3328#comment-16109</guid>
		<description>Your view is simply dated. Although your inclusion of the wire is encouraging especially the et Al part. This suggests that a masterpiece can be created by more than one. The internet is a true masterpiece but in a wholly new way. It is not defined by an individual. We may be able to pluck an single piece and say this is good. But the Monster that is the whole is far more beguiling than any of the examples you suggest.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Your view is simply dated. Although your inclusion of the wire is encouraging especially the et Al part. This suggests that a masterpiece can be created by more than one. The internet is a true masterpiece but in a wholly new way. It is not defined by an individual. We may be able to pluck an single piece and say this is good. But the Monster that is the whole is far more beguiling than any of the examples you suggest.</p>
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		<title>Comment on The Kingdom of Awesome by Justin McMurray</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/the-kingdom-of-awesome-003335#comment-16108</link>
		<dc:creator>Justin McMurray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 20:18:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3335#comment-16108</guid>
		<description>I want a burger with extra awesomesauce.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I want a burger with extra awesomesauce.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Can there ever be an online masterpiece? by James Higgs</title>
		<link>http://madebymany.co.uk/can-there-ever-be-an-online-masterpiece-003328#comment-16102</link>
		<dc:creator>James Higgs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 14 Mar 2010 19:56:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://madebymany.co.uk/?p=3328#comment-16102</guid>
		<description>Totally disagree. The internet is not a masterpiece of the same order as any of the works I cite. To apply Wittgenstein&#039;s family resemblance terms as Harry suggests, there are no resemblances. The web is brilliant, I love it and it has brought about enormous change. But it is not a work of art. Unless, as I&#039;ve said before, we define the word art so broadly that it ceases to have any practical meaning at all. In which case we just need a new word.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Totally disagree. The internet is not a masterpiece of the same order as any of the works I cite. To apply Wittgenstein&#8217;s family resemblance terms as Harry suggests, there are no resemblances. The web is brilliant, I love it and it has brought about enormous change. But it is not a work of art. Unless, as I&#8217;ve said before, we define the word art so broadly that it ceases to have any practical meaning at all. In which case we just need a new word.</p>
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